[DVATM]

Hi thought I would share my current DEF warning fun. I have recently had the dosing error message (different to the insufficient quality one). So - I took the car to the specialist (Paul at Ultimate Cats - total legend) and machine plugged in, error codes received and Jag contacted. I parked up the car, used the back up for work and drove precious miles watching the countdown at the weekend to keep the battery charged. Car is booked for Thursday to go in and get fiddled with. The weird thing is, today I drove out for a bit and THE MESSAGE DISAPPEARED!! Wtf?! I had been driving fairly constantly 400 miles per week throughout (key worker) before it appeared. From the messages here I guess I have urea crystals blocking up the injector but it appears to have resolved "naturally." I will still take it in and ask the specialist to eyeball the various gubbins but if anyone has had the same experience or can advise I'd be grateful. I love my XE otherwise. The next one will definitely not be a diesel, though...

 

[jacw001]

If the DEF tank was overfilled, who filled it and why?

Thanks for reply.

To give some context I bought the car in October last year and have drove roughly 3.5k miles. As I said before when I got the "Incorrect DEF quality detected" message I hadn't got any prompts or warnings regarding DEF before. I hadn't even thought about Adblue at all - this was my first ever warning message on the car. After getting this message and the countdown came on I decided, having consulted this forum to put 5 litres into the Adblue tank - to see if this would help remedy the warning as it could take some time to register etc. Considering the tank is meant to have a 16L capacity; in my opinion this could not have 'overfilled' the tank.

Would I have grounds for complaints?

Unfortunately I think you have shot yourself in the foot. If you can't check the DEF level your car is 1000 miles per litre so probably early 16. The later 500 miles per litre cars have a dashboard check for DEF. The warning that came up was about DEF quality, almost certainly wrong as it's never a quality problem anyway, it's always something else in DEF dosing chain. However it didn't tell you it needed refilling and when you added 5 litres you probably either got very near or over the tank capacity, at which point the sensor in the tank detected an overfill and probably triggered another fault. When you took it to the dealer he read the fault codes and found it overfilled so providing a justification for charging you a hefty sum for sorting it.

You could try a complaint and explain exactly what you did and why but I fear it will be a case of "Sorry Sir......."

This Adblue thing is a mystry to most of us. It is simply a mind game and everyone is guessing where is the 'max threshold'. I had two problems with the AbBlue sensors before and they were all dealt with by Jag under warrantly. The AbBlue tank was drained and filled in by Jag in March just before the warranty expired.

Accordingly to the above, I do not have a DEF level display and my reg is 17, hence it would fall within the 1000 miles per litre catergory. But why when I checked the count down clock when it was filled in March (I have done 100 miles max since March), it is showing me 5,000 miles, not 16,000 miles?

 

[BOBCDP]

Thanks for reply.

To give some context I bought the car in October last year and have drove roughly 3.5k miles. As I said before when I got the "Incorrect DEF quality detected" message I hadn't got any prompts or warnings regarding DEF before. I hadn't even thought about Adblue at all - this was my first ever warning message on the car. After getting this message and the countdown came on I decided, having consulted this forum to put 5 litres into the Adblue tank - to see if this would help remedy the warning as it could take some time to register etc. Considering the tank is meant to have a 16L capacity; in my opinion this could not have 'overfilled' the tank.

Would I have grounds for complaints?

Unfortunately I think you have shot yourself in the foot. If you can't check the DEF level your car is 1000 miles per litre so probably early 16. The later 500 miles per litre cars have a dashboard check for DEF. The warning that came up was about DEF quality, almost certainly wrong as it's never a quality problem anyway, it's always something else in DEF dosing chain. However it didn't tell you it needed refilling and when you added 5 litres you probably either got very near or over the tank capacity, at which point the sensor in the tank detected an overfill and probably triggered another fault. When you took it to the dealer he read the fault codes and found it overfilled so providing a justification for charging you a hefty sum for sorting it.

You could try a complaint and explain exactly what you did and why but I fear it will be a case of "Sorry Sir......."

This Adblue thing is a mystry to most of us. It is simply a mind game and everyone is guessing where is the 'max threshold'. I had two problems with the AbBlue sensors before and they were all dealt with by Jag under warrantly. The AbBlue tank was drained and filled in by Jag in March just before the warranty expired.

Accordingly to the above, I do not have a DEF level display and my reg is 17, hence it would fall within the 1000 miles per litre catergory. But why when I checked the count down clock when it was filled in March (I have done 100 miles max since March), it is showing me 5,000 miles, not 16,000 miles?

I think I may have misled you be saying you could check the DEF level. It's not a level check, it just shows you how many miles you have left before a refill is required. This changed in 2016 when Jaguar did a model upgrade. One of the things they did was to add the round central display between the speedo and the rev counter. At the same time they doubled the adblue dose to the exhaust so that instead of 1000 mpl it became 500 mpl. They also made it possible to check the distance you had left before a refill was required. On the previous model 2015-2016 there was no way of checking and you had to either top it up as you went based on your mileage or just wait until the warning came up which was my preferred method, just adding 10 litres so I knew I was never overfilling the tank thereby causing further problems.
If you have a 17 car you have a round display and the dose is 500 mpl hence it shows a lower reading. Maybe it only had 10 litres added which would explain why it is now showing 5000 miles.

 

[gsb1970]

From now on I will make mine into a dealer to be topped up. For me, the £30 is worth it and it's not like it has to be filled every month. Last fill lasted over 9000 from memory.

Anyway, my lovely cat is going back on Thursday (lease). 5 lovely year's, almost trouble-free as well. Staying with jaguar and purchased a 2016 XF V6 diesel

 

[xeprestige180]

What a lovely retirement present. Not. Been to the dealer twice for regeneration and then NOx sensor replacement. 46200 miles on the clock, totally cherished with full Jaguar main dealer FSH. Then this. Gutted. What next I don't know but I think I'm done with JLR.

 

[TBW142]

So I have the same warning as everyone else now 'quality issue', jag 2015 2.0L D. What a bloody ballache this car is! Booked in with jag for Monday who want £180 just for a diagnostic test really not sure why that can be justified when there's the warning but pretty sure jag just make up the charges. Definitely last time I will be getting anything from JLR.

I am going to try and get it into kwik fit tomorrow as I had a main engine issue awhile back and they were very good, but they may be able to tell more once they plug it in.

Otherwise shall be attempting to drain the tank and clean the injector this weekend following everyone's guides on here and abit of help from YouTube. Let's see if it works!

 

[gsb1970]

Have you considered an independent specialist jag garage? We have 2 up here in west yorks. At least half the price of dealerships

 

[TBW142]

Afternoon, yes that's what I thought would be the best option as I am willing to do anything to avoid the main dealers. I managed to get in with one in kent today, who plugged it in cleared other warnings (from its engine rebuild), the error has changed now to 'dosing malfunction' I have about 330 miles left on the clock, but it's with them on Monday. They are guessing it may be the injector needs cleaning or replacing and or the Noz sensor may be playing silly buggers.
🤞it just needs cleaning. However, reading other bb's once you get this message then after a decent drive it can suddenly clear the message. However, so not to burn through miles I shall save that drive for tomorrow enroute to work.

 

[TBW142]

So after all this, I took it to the jag specialist where he cleared fault codes etc and it changed the message to dosing malfunction. After another 80miles or so driving (just as I pulled off the a road his morning to take it back to him) the alarm cleared itself. He gave it the once over and plugged it in. All appears good &#x1f937-1f3fb-2642;

 

[daire1976]

I have had a similar saga, I bought the car in March, literally 3 days before lockdown, it was going great and 2 months in it developed the "incorrect grade exhaust fluid, 512 miles to no engine restarts", I took it to a reputable jaguar garage, jagtech in Stockton and they drained system and refilled with adblue before resetting, all was well for almost 3 months and on a trip to London it reappeared, I had to travel to London so drove remainder of way and drove home to northeast with literally 30miles left, managed to get jagtech to have a look but prior to bringing it in I removed the adblue injector and cleaned the crystalline build up, jagtech done me a favour as they were fully booked and plugged diagnostics in and reset, with a view to getting booked back in within a few weeks but now we are back in lockdown. They advised that jaguar are really vague with help regarding the issue and have advised a 4 stage check, 1, drain down and replace adblue, 2 software update, 3 injector check and replace if any crystallisation, 4 sensor replace . Typically the fault reappeared last week whilst returning from London again. As the garage couldn't fit me in for a week I have purchased a panasonic hard book with the full JLR sdd software and a mongoose device. Today after 4 hours I managed to fathom my way through the sdd system and reset the fault, it got me to perform a number of tests with the injector removed from the exhaust and tested the spray pattern, then the quantity of adblue over a few minutes and the injector done exactly as it should, there was absolutely no crystallisation of the injector head so this has me leaning toward it being a o2 sensor further back. The injector is performing as should, the adblue is less than 1600 mile old, so my next step is to work out how to perform some checks on rear o2 sensor, but at 130-180 for a diagnostic that even jaguar seem to be struggling to understand I think I will use the "reset method" for now until they can offer a guaranteed fix as I don't want to be paying for diagnostics every few months.

 

[MrBean]

Here is my take and solution on this warning....

I have owned my Jag XE (180ps, auto, Prestige) for 2 and a bit years and have seen this issue twice on a yearly basis (and once more) the series of events are:

1) Dashboard warning: incorrect fluid detected
2) Drive about 60 miles
3) Dashboard warning changes to: NOx malfunction, 512 miles no engine restarts
4) Fill up with any 10lt forecourt Adblue.
5) Clear fault codes using OBD scanner, note at this point, the "NOx malfunction, 512 miles no engine restarts" warning on the dash is still present. At this stage it is reporting a lower mileage based on the miles I have done since fault first appeared, I.e. it appears the fault has not been reset
6) I continue driving, after about another 100 miles, the fault code goes away. This happens every time. Never changed parts.

My conclusion is that the software (not sure about the newer cars) is very sensitive and gets out of sync after the initial code.

I think for the garages, after resetting the ecu they don't see the fault on the dash go away they start more drastic measures. In my opinion, asking the garage to hold fire at this stage for a 100 miles or so would save swapping out parts and by the sounds of it a lot of cost.

In terms of the give it '100' miles or so after ecu reset to clear codes is either because the software needs a number of ignition cycles to validate the code has gone. Or needs to go through a regen. Not sure the exact logic.

Why every year: my theory is the Adblue starts to crystallise the less there is. Also the percentage of actual urea left in the mix diminishes. So the warning is probably genuine. However, the software does not clear the fault even when the NOx is compliant (I.e. after a refill). It seems to stay in a permanent 'false positive' state after the initial fault is flagged. And only a ecu reset and annoyingly some 100 miles / regen / ignition cycles will change this.

 

[Fighterpilot]

That is my thoughts as well. I have never let mine get low enough and usually top up with 1 ltr every now and then. In 5 years I have had the car I have never seen the warnings many have. Yes, the car uses the muck and I am now into a second 10 litre tub about 60% left. It is kept fully insulated from heat and frost and I give it a gentle shake before adding it to the tank following the bottle method of a deleted user. (732 from memory)

 

[WalnutGrip]

Hi, I'm on my 8th stoppage for this problem. Went to a Jaguar main dealer, Lancaster Land Rover Birmingham. This is the forth time at the same one, they cannot find the fault. Cost £180.00 to £200.00 a time.
First time they changed the Knox sensor, did a reset it lasted a week. Second time they did a complete dio' nothing found, another reset ok. Third time they had the car for 48 hours, another complete dio, nothing found, last resort they tested the ad blue, found to be faulty, (I filled it with Jaguar ad blue that I purchased from a main Jaguar dealership) they drained the ad blue and refilled it. Did a reset, ok.
This has lasted 19 days, then the dreaded ad blue incorrect quality exhaust fluid detected sign came up on the screen. Went straight back to the dealership, cutting a long story short, he said its not the ad blue its something else. The Knox sensor has nothing to do with the the ad blue.
To sum up if the Jaguar dealer has not found anything wrong after someone else has put ad blue in the tank its my fault. But if Jaguar has filled the tank then its not the ad blue its something else that's wrong.

 

[Indianajons]

Hi, I'm on my 8th stoppage for this problem. Went to a Jaguar main dealer, Lancaster Land Rover Birmingham. This is the forth time at the same one, they cannot find the fault. Cost £180.00 to £200.00 a time.
First time they changed the Knox sensor, did a reset it lasted a week. Second time they did a complete dio' nothing found, another reset ok. Third time they had the car for 48 hours, another complete dio, nothing found, last resort they tested the ad blue, found to be faulty, (I filled it with Jaguar ad blue that I purchased from a main Jaguar dealership) they drained the ad blue and refilled it. Did a reset, ok.
This has lasted 19 days, then the dreaded ad blue incorrect quality exhaust fluid detected sign came up on the screen. Went straight back to the dealership, cutting a long story short, he said its not the ad blue its something else. The Knox sensor has nothing to do with the the ad blue.
To sum up if the Jaguar dealer has not found anything wrong after someone else has put ad blue in the tank its my fault. But if Jaguar has filled the tank then its not the ad blue its something else that's wrong.

Could be crystals on the injector…. see this thread https://www.xeforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=9690&p=113064&hilit=Penny07915#p113064

 

[exhee]

Easy fix - The system cannot measure adblue quality, it just looks at the resulting emissions after adblue injection and as it does not see the result its looking for defaults to "Adblue quality" message. I suppose if you put water in the tank or something then its working on that basis. Any aftermarket Adblue you buy in the shops is perfectly acceptable, it meets standards.
The problem almost certainly is the adblue injector has gummed up, and its mating port on the exhaust. You can remove and clean it, clear down the fault code with most code readers (no need for Jaguar/Landrover dealer) and it will change message to Dosing Fault. After 10 to 30 miles the warning lights just extinguish. If the fault reappears (or if you are so inclined) then you can change the adblue injector for a new one (part number is FX23-189E3-AA). The whole job cleaning or changing takes just 30 minutes and only tool you need is a 6mm allen key (oh, and a jack). See this video for brief explanation of how to do the job but there are a number of examples on Youtube to get a complete perspective.

 

[SMH]

Hi, I’m located in Australia and I’ve recently discovered this forum. If it wasn’t for this forum I would have been none the wiser.
I purchased a 2016 Jaguar XE less than 12 months ago and I have had issues, much like I find in your forums. Obviously these issues are well known to Jaguar. I purchased an aftermarket warranty from the dealership, well I have since discovered that it isn’t worth the paper it’s written on. This is a 6 year old prestige brand car, this should not be happening!
My issues in less that 12 months requiring replacement
• Dampers
• Engine mounts
• Control valve
• Now onto my third Ad Blue Quality Warning!!

Has anyone discussed in previous posts about a legal worldwide Class Action against Jaguar as these known issues impacting thousands of Jaguar XE owners should at have warranted a recall.

 

[Fighterpilot]

Your warranty will have the " we cover nothing that is classed as a wearble part" that means nearly everything that is a consumable such as brakes, tyres, exhausts and anything else they feel is a consumable wearable. I would have thought the engine mounts should be covered but not dampers and have a look at my Adblue thoughts in other posts. Other makes using Adblue also have the same problems.

 

[PaulTolga]

Hi, I’m located in Australia and I’ve recently discovered this forum. If it wasn’t for this forum I would have been none the wiser.
I purchased a 2016 Jaguar XE less than 12 months ago and I have had issues, much like I find in your forums. Obviously these issues are well known to Jaguar. I purchased an aftermarket warranty from the dealership, well I have since discovered that it isn’t worth the paper it’s written on. This is a 6 year old prestige brand car, this should not be happening!
My issues in less that 12 months requiring replacement
• Dampers
• Engine mounts
• Control valve
• Now onto my third Ad Blue Quality Warning!!

Has anyone discussed in previous posts about a legal worldwide Class Action against Jaguar as these known issues impacting thousands of Jaguar XE owners should at have warranted a recall.

Rather late on this one, but for completeness as this has just been raised by one of my kids who seems to have been watching American legal dramas there is no British "Class Action". In British common law there is "Group Litigation" and it has just not caught on here, unlike US and Australia (an early adopter since the 90s).
Someone did post about diesel engines (timing chains)across JLR products but I don't think it has gone anywhere. It's perhaps the most likely to have some merit. The other items are wear and tear or common to all manufacturers.

 

[donhall415]

My F pace is showing this fault. Ive read various reasons for it. Question , will my car fail to start after 512 miles?

 

[Indianajons]

My F pace is showing this fault. Ive read various reasons for it. Question , will my car fail to start after 512 miles?

Yes, definitely, you need to get it sorted. Don't go to a main dealer though, they'll just rip you off, take it to an independent Jaguar specialist or try to fix it yourself first.